Pens Fan

The RLX is a classy car whose looks will age well-understated elegance.

holografique

Yup, that's probably me. Although which Peachtree Rd? There are dozens in Atlanta...

Seriously though, I've yet to see another single RLX anywhere in the ATL area. Anyone else out there?

victorber

Now that I have close to 700 miles on mine I have a very difficult time getting to my destination, I keep finding somewhere else to go....It almost is starting to piss off my wife...
Absolutely love this car...!!!!

Colin

Isn't there still a scenic roads feature? I assume there is, but we don't have any featured drives in that system. Wait till you show her that one....

holografique

Seriously...I find myself dealing with urges in the evening to just go drive...for no good reason other than to drive the car. Fraking love mine. Incredible car.

Glad to start seeing some other happy users on here. Tired of the hate fest.

seanlin

I don't drive it in the evening often. But whenever I do it, the LED headlight is pretty impressive. Super White and bright. Can't love it more.

victorber

I totally agree with you regarding the haters. I just read the reviews to give me a cursory overview of the vehicle, then I visit the dealer and spend as much time as necessary to formulate my own opinion.

I usually have to make at least 2 trips to the dealership...

One of the reasons I like the Acura and Honda products is their approach to logical engineering. Design enough HP to move the vehicle without over designing.
I can't wait till we are on the road to MT and Canada provinces.

neuronbob

Haters gon' hate. Just ignore them.

weather

Where about in Canada are you going?

On a separate note, I was finally able to see the RLX and the 14' MDX in person last Friday! Both are amazing looking vehicle and although the RLX does not fit the vehicle I want to drive at the moment, it sure looks better in person than some of the pics I have seen online. The MDX is really nice too....we have a different wood trim available in our MDX and it looks so elegant! I am not sure why Acura didn't make that wood trim standard in the RLX?!

victorber

Our trip starts here on the east coast and goes up to Montana and then up to Calgary ( if it's still there) and onto Edmonton.
We will stop in a few locations on the way but will end up coming back down to Sioux Falls and onto Branson, MO before coming home.
That should help the break-in of the RLX...

Pens Fan

I first test drove the RLX in February (short drive) and was very impressed. I took an extended test drive this weekend and am even more impressed. The hate fest is hard to fathom or take seriously, I am more interested in what owners have to say and from reading their posts on this board and also after my extended drive I think this car is flying under the radar and is a top notch vehicle. The pricing is very aggressive right now and further discounted with the current $2,500 loyalty from Acura. I can lease this vehicle for more than $100 less a month than the 2005 model I had. How unbelievable is that?

2011TL

I would appreciate some info on how the Acura loyalty program works. I have a 2009 TL Tech SH-AWD. Does that qualify, or do I need an RL for trade-in? Thanks.

KeithL

You have to be a current Acura owner, so you should qualify. The details are on the Acura website.

Colin

Generally loyalty is any 2003 Acura and newer. You don't need to trade in the car, but it must be registered in your name or immediate family members name in the same household.

Jackzilla

As a former '06 RL - ACC/CMBS owner and current '12 Hyundai Genesis 3.8 owner, I could not convince myself to even bother visiting an Acura dealer for a look at the RLX. The drive train alone (310HP, 6-speed FWD vs 333HP, 8-speed RWD) is, to me, behind the curve already. Moreover, other than the P-AWS, none of the tech features break any new ground - comparable features are available even on Ford Taurus for much less money.
Compared to the '05 RL, when introduced, the new RLX, for me, is a big disappointment. Breaks no new ground and is so blandly styled it is hard for anyone not a 'car guy' to tell it is Acura's flagship model and not just a bigger, fancier Honda. If it had featured more breakthrough styling like the coming NSX, it would be a winner.
Two cents worth from a disappointed former owner.

victorber

Well, here I was cruising the interstate about 70mph and just feeling in awe on how this car just simply wants to drive itself (with LKAS and CMBS) and BANG I get a big orange warning...telling me the vehicle requires "Hands On" the steering wheel. WOW! I never thought the sensors were that sensitive, Way to go Acura!!!

Actually it was quite a shock!

Anyone else want to admit to day-dreaming..

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

I think you focus a lot on the spec sheet.

For me, I look at the spec sheet, then look at actual performance figures, real world mpg, user-friendliness of a car, how well the features actually perform, etc. Most of the time, Honda's put up better numbers in the real world than the power figures suggest. Recent examples include the new Accord (both I4 and V6 models).

As for features, there are many cars that have the same features as the RLX. But the difference is how well do theey work and how relevant are they do the driver and passengers. For instance, VW and Audi came up with dual-clutch transmission. Out in the real world, the DSG delivers better performance by quicker shifts (also shorter gearing). The overall experience is smooth and quick. Other manufacturers also come up with their own dual clutch systems, but most of them fall short. For instance, there are several tests that say the Hyundai's dual clutch system shifts slower than a regular automatic transmission and does not improve acceleration time. Smoothness is also a concern. In that case, why bother having this feature if it does not perform well?

Then there's also the fact that some companies simply lie in their spec sheets. For example, Hyundai and Kia last year was caught providing false mileage ratings to EPA for many of their models:

http://wot.motortrend.com/we-hear-hy...#axzz2bJOCeqAH

Testing error? Sure, that is possible if it's for one trim. But testing error for that many models? Would you really believe that? For a company of that size? And we aren't talking about 1 or 2 mpg. We are talking about as much as 6mpg in some cases. That's huge.

Jackzilla

iforyou:
My understanding of the EPA milage estimates controversy was one of interpretation of how a set of complex testing procedures were to be carried out. Apparently, Hyundai interpreted them in a way that yielded the most aggressive results - evident in the fact that it was over an entire lineup of vehicles. Actual lying or honest misinterpretation of rules? Who knows.
However, in the case of at least our Genesis, the car actually delivers in excess of 2 miles per gallon BETTER highway mileage than the so-called inflated figure -- 31-32 mpg vs erroneous EPA rating of 29 (@ avg of 70+mph)
Moreover, Hyundai stepped up to the plate and refunded the supposed excess fuel costs that customers incurred, up to that point, and ongoing for as long a ownership continued.
This was in sharp contrast to the way Honda/Acura treated those owners who were unlucky enough to have purchased a Honda/Acura vehicle with Michelin's PAX run-flat tires. I was one of those "fortunate" ones -- offered as compensation a discount on a nearly $500 mini spare plus an extended warranty (from Michelin) on the tires --IF YOU COULD FIND MICHELIN DEALER who had training and special equipment to service your problem. Honda/Acura made absolutely no offer to replace the wheel/tire assemblies, which cost over $2000 just for the tires, if you could find a dealer that handled them!
God help you if you got a puncture on a road trip - 100 miles on the run-flats would be lucky if you could find a service facility.
I ended up replacing all of the wheels and tires at my expense (not a dime from Acura)just for the ability to take a trip without fear of unrepairable tire failure.
And, that's actual experience, not something off of a fact sheet!

Brother Acura

Posted this on another site. It sums up how I feel about this car. It's far and away the best Acura I've ever had and probably the best I've ever driven.

I've been driving this car for a while now. I'm not a professional auto reviewer but I am an engineer and I've owned Mercedes, Lexus and Audi. I've also been buying Acuras since 1989. This car is by far the best all around car that I've driven. The build quality is beyond reproach. It's quiet as a vault and handles like a much smaller car. The P-AWS system is just incredibly well engineered. I can not tell that this is FWD car. I've had three SH-AWD Acuras and I find the P-AWS actually more fun and responsive at the speeds I regularly drive at. The ride at highway speed is perfectly suited to my tastes (firm but compliant) and I really haven't noticed any of the low speed ride harshness that has been mentioned. I'll admit that the exterior styling is not awe inspiring but I find it quite elegant in a buttoned down, understated sort of way. I think the look will wear well over time. Acura consistently does a great job with interior design and the RLX is, in my opinion, their best effort to date.

I've read all the reviews (thanks TSX69) and they are all over the place. The CR review, in fact most of this year's CR evaluations, is so far off the mark they've lost credibility for me. Honestly, I don't get all this bitchin' about the car. I don't think many of these nay-sayers have the balls to admit that Acura may have done something remarkable here using something other then their precious FR layout. Yes, perhaps I'm an Acura fan-boy and the RLX has made me feel pretty good about that. Well done Acura. Thanks for a terrific automobile.

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

I believe Hyundai have been selling cars in North American for decades. To think a company of such immense size, with such long history and experience to make such error is a bit hard to believe at best. The thing is, this was not the first time a "testing error" occurred for Hyundai. Back in early 2000's, Hyundai was caught and later admitted that the company has been overrating engine output on their vehicles. This affected up to 850,000 owners. I'd imagine after making such mistake just 10 years ago, the company would pay more attention when it comes to testing their vehicles. Wouldn't you agree on that?

Here is the link to the settlement:
http://www.autoblog.com/2004/06/22/h...power-lawsuit/

EPA highway cycle is not the same as one driving on the freeway at 70mph. If you look at the cycle, it consists of an initial acceleration from 0mph, and fluctuations between 35-60mph. Obviously, when there's acceleration and deceleration, the car is less efficient. This is why many cars out there can do better than the EPA highway rating on the freeway. For instance, my 11-year old TL-S with an ancient 5AT with 4 people and full trunk gets 30-32mpg from Vancouver to Calgary where there is a lot of hill climbs, even though the car is rated at 27mpg on the highway only.

I must give Hyundai the credit for the excellent PR and marketing. They did a good job of turning something really bad into something that looks really good. If Hyundai did not do anything, wouldn't you think EPA and the US government will do something about it? For me, Hyundai got away easily by just paying the owners the fuel cost difference. Hyundai had been advertising about how fuel efficient their cars are. If these people knew before that their cars weren't as efficient as they first led to believe, would they have bought their cars? Hyundai already got their money from the owners. They already stole sales from competitors, meaning competitors lost profits. Also, the owners are now stuck with cars that are not as efficient as they first thought, how would that affect resale values? To me, it's just much more than just the fuel cost difference in this issue. All the other costs would be difficult to calculate.

JM2010 SH-AWD

As to the Hyundai, as someone already said, the mpg discrepancy was not isolated, but across the line, and it was not minor. They were advertising the hell out of "40 mpg" but that was a joke. Our '13 Accord is rated at 34 highway, but routinely hits 40. We have a "reverse-Hyundai" issue, and I'm very happy about it.

I know the Genesis is a pretty decent car, but I just can't see the value in their overall lineup. I rent a lot of cars for work. I just got a new Sonata this evening. This thing feels cheap, flexy and like a tin can compared to our Accord and to the '14 Impala I had last week. The quality is just not there, and anyone who says these cars are on par with similar offerings from Toyota, Honda and Nissan does not have very discriminating perception related to cars.

victorber

I am really amazed at how this thread has taken off. Most of, if not all the manufactures have multiple pots of money to satisfy different sub-production programs, i.e.: Warranty, Retrofit, Technical Support, Spares, Suites etc.. and all $'s for these sub-programs are rolled into the selling price of the vehicle/s. So, the manufactures are not really loosing any money, and if costs really get out of control, they can still write off the excess costs from their taxes...

I know for a fact that my 09 TL Tech regularly got 34 mpg on trip across country and that made me so giddy I had to take a pix of the speedometer in motion. If I remember correctly the EPA estimated mileage was 27....

There seems to be a number of people that feel you need to have a 400hp car to enjoy the ride that the RLX provides. I have always felt that a sedan like the RLX is a classy ride and matching HP and TQ are more important, as it compliments the trickle down suspension technology from their F1 program.
I still love this car, best investment in a vehicle I have ever made!
Still my 02 cents worth.

George Knighton

No, I don't really like it at all.

But I've never really cared much for what cars looked like, hence my current daily driver. :-)

I'm hopeful that the hybrid SH-AWD car with Honda's first automated manual, a lot more HP and 30 mpg might change my mind about the RLX's viability.

Here's the thing, though. The dowdy FWD version can sticker for over 61,000 with Advance.

Sort of takes your breath away when you think about what the SH-AWD version would cost.

Maybe they'll have a way to configure it just for people like me, SH-AWD, Tech Pkg, ELS (not Krell) and maybe not so much overpriced that it takes my breath away.

jhr3uva90

I like the RLX, but I really agree with you regarding prices. Acura should have dropped the MSRP by at least $2500 so that the P-AWS/Advance package would be below $60K. One consistent gripe I hear from reviewers is how high the "maxed out" price is. In fact, I am now considering the new MDX because it has most of the features of the RLX, plus SH-AWD, plus more cubic feet of space for less money.

GoHawks

If you go back 5-6 years on the 2nd gen RL forum I'm sure you'll find posts that sound pretty familiar to this from many of us, including me. SH-AWD was pretty cool technology that really did a lot to mask the FWD platform. The 2nd gen RL even out performed and came out on top or near the top in many comparison tests , even beating out the BMW 5 series in one that I recall (unlike the current RLX). Only as it aged did it get continued negative criticism.

In the end none of the positive press mattered, the RL just didn't get the respect and as a consequence the sales.

jhr3uva90

I agree. Hopefully, the Sport Hybrid version of the RLX will earn some excellent reviews, even if it doesn't have excellent sales. Right now, the P-AWS version of the RLX seems to be "meh" as far as the popular opinion goes.

TonyCD

One big difference was that a lot of critics really liked the RL (David E. Davis Jr. for Automobile, Car and Driver, Dan Neil although he now denies it), although it then failed to sell anyway. The RLX has been almost universally panned from Day One.

jhr3uva90

"Panned" is such a strong word. It is more like a universal shrugging of shoulders.

neuronbob

I agree with Tony. The 2G RL was universally acclaimed when it came out. The primary problem is that the competition caught up quickly and Acura didn't market after the first few months.

The response of the automotive press to the RLX has ranged from "meh" to "what was Acura thinking?"

Colin

Funny, I think the RLX is the perfect car for Acura. It's FWD and that is what we do. It's roomy, quiet, and well built. As a car it's a good one even if it lacks the 'flair' so many want.

IMO, where they screwed up is there are too many trim levels and thus not enough selection for customers on the lot. How are we supposed to sell this car? If someone comes in and wants a Pomegranate Pearl in Krell? Tell him it'll be 3-4 months and I can't quote a lease price because the rates and residuals will change? Plus, just stocking 4-5 means the store ties up $200,000 in inventory costs to sell them at what profit margin? Why not spend the same money on MDXs that sell for more margin and faster?

jhr3uva90

Doesn't the Lexus GS come in more trim levels than the RLX? How do they deal with it? And regarding profit margin, doesn't the RLX's relatively low profit margin say something about how the market feels about the car?

Colin

I don't know how many trims they have nor do I care. What works for others, may not work for us. It should be obvious by now that Acura and Lexus have different clientele. A common thread is that buyers won't wait 3 months for a 'mere' Acura but would for other 'higher' brands. Not being judgmental, but understanding this mindset, why not build cars that fit the buying demo?

The RLX debuted with a below MSRP lease. As for margin, if they price it 'right' from the start, they don't need to add incentives to sell. However, it seems like it's the new Acura pricing philosophy that started ~2004 and really hit it's stride in 2009. Price it high, add incentive money if that doesn't work. Again, (IMO) what works for others may not work for us.

KeithL

Lexus is worse, there are like 5 or 6 options packages, and even those don't include some of the options available. It does cause them issues becaus when I was shopping the GS I could not find anything equipped the way I wanted it in the color I wanted. Few people buy these cars fully loaded. Look at dealer inventory and you will see. Look at Infiniti M inventory, most are base with Premium package and a few might have Deluxe Touring. And the tech package is as rare as the dodo bird, let alone a M Sport Touring with Tech. I looked for 3-4 months and gave up and decided to jump ship.

KeithL

Honestly everyone does it, the consumer will not buy a car without incentives with a few exceptions. Even BMW, MB, Audi and Lexus offer incentives. Saturn tried MSRP no incentive pricing and that got them no where once the novelty wore off. The consumer needs to feel the price paid is worth what they are getting. And when you are not Tier 1 brand it is harder to command $60K prices.

Honestly I still think for the money the RLX offers a great deal of value, but for $60K you need to offer more than value to most people shopping at those price points.

hondamore

I agree ^^

Most buyers and especially traditionally conservative Honda/Acura buyers love to buy a $60,000 car for $52,000. If they priced the same car at an MSRP of $52,000, the same buyers would want to buy it for $45,000. I must admit that I am right smack in the middle of said "thrifty" group.

In addition, the buyers then get to show off their shiny new "$60,000 car" to their friends.

It is best to start high, make max profit early on and then discount to a point where they sell later on.

Just my opinion.

jhr3uva90

I guess you have a good point. However, I think there are some potential buyers (and reviewers) who see a $60K price tag for the RLX and say "what's the point?" They won't even factor in the "real" selling price.

KeithL

If Lexus were starting today I think they would have the same problem breaking into Tier 1 players. Most people looking to drop $60K or more want to make people to know they have a nice car, while I do not care what people think about what I like or drive, the world if full of status seeking people.

hondamore

You're right, the hefty MSRP has likely chased away some buyers. The other way that Acura could have gone is to price the RLX $5000+ cheaper across the board and tried to make sales as being a "great value" in the segment. Unfortunately, in the luxury segment above $50,000, Acura's lack of snob appeal would still limit sales and it would still be the same loyal Acura buyers or the same thrifty bargain hunters making the purchases at the "real pricing" after even further discounts. The pricing scheme they chose at least gives some weight behind the claim of the RLX being a "flagship" complete with $60,000+ pricetag.

Colin

Once again, what works for other may not work for us. We've sold many product at full list through the years and often well over MSRP. But our market is different.

Regardless, we're mostly saying the same thing in different ways. Acura's 'niche' was always well equipped for the money. You never felt you got 'cheated' of a feature because there were only two trims, base (fully equipped) or Navi.

These days, everybody talks about the RLX being a 60K car when it starts at $48,500. IMO, they needed 3 price points, 49K, 55K and 59K. Anyway, we won't see the whole plan till the TLX is released, maybe then the sedan picture will be clearer since by then they hybrid should be out too.

JM2010 SH-AWD

Agree. A couple of times I have looked at Lexus cars, but it's nearly impossible to get a car the way you want it. I gave up and went away. Same with Infiniti, in my experience. I wanted to test and possibly buy a G37 sedan with 6MT. I found little interest displayed by dealers in even seeing if they could get one, even to buy, much less to test.