TampaRLX-SH

It is finally time to replace the OWM Michelin MXM4s. I have been waffling over replacement tires since the RL was new. The Michelins did the job, work satisfactorily but finally have worn enought to become too slippery and noisy with 34K on them (outer shoulders also pretty worn).

I have narrowed it down to either the Bridgestone Serenity or the Continental ExtremeContact DWS. They are rated fairly close, where the Contis have a slight edge on performance, and the BS on quiet/comfort. Being in Florida, my primary performance need is wet traction but also the roads are coarse here, so quiet and smooth is paramount. Either tire will likely be a tremendous improvement over the MXM4s. The Contis are Summer Max Performance, BS are A/S Grand Touring. Both are appreciably better than Michelins in price (including the Pilot Sport - which I have ruled out)

I am looking for RL owners with either of these tires for feedback compared to the MXM4s. I am not an extreme performance needs driver and the RL already far exceeds my driving style. How are they holding up after the 1st 10 - 15k miles? Many tires when new are great, but wear quickly or become noisy. Balancing problems? How is weight affecting ride and efficiency? The Contis are 5lbs lighter than the BS.

Finally, I am not looking to change from OEM wheels or size. I am quite happy with them...actually like the OEM wheels. So please, input from owners with OEM size Bridgestone Serenity or Continenal Extreme Contact DWS.

Chas2

Just a small point of difference, which changes nothing else about your question.

The ContiExtremeContact DWS is still an all season tire, not a max performance summer tire. It is in the so called Ultra High Performance AS category as opposed to the Grand Touring AS category that the BS Serenity is in.

I have no experience with either, unfortunately, and would like to hear what others say.

TampaRLX-SH

You are correct Chas. The DWS is all season, the DW is Summer. I had multiple websites open as I was comparing them, and TireRack was the DWS in my RL's size.

white05rl

I just got a set of the DWS and am a little uncertain to recommend them. Maybe it's just NTB, but the car doesn't seem near as stable at highway speeds (wandering, needing constant corrections, vibrations, etc.). I've had them balanced twice (both times two of the tires were way out of balance) since getting them (about a month ago) and had the alignment checked three times. My car wants to drift right...sometimes slightly and sometimes not-so slighty.

I have an appointment at the Dealer this Thursday (for some unrelated items) and will have them check the "tire problems" too.

On the PLUS, they are very quiet and ride really well. They also look pretty cool with the aggressive tread pattern. I'm curious to know if I'm the only guy having problems with the DWS.

Chas2

Unfortunately, this has been my very experience with the predecessor tires, Conti ExtremeContact UHPAS tires in 225/50-16 on an Acura Legend. The wear was also about half of what you got on the Michelins, about 20K miles, but I was so eager to find an excuse to dump them, I probably got rid of them earlier than I might have otherwise.

Based on that one experience, with 6 examples of the tires, I would not buy Continentals again...which is a purely emotional reaction, but they were that much trouble.

The DWS are a new design, new generation of tire, in a different size, possibly even manufactured in a different factory so drawing any parallels is sketchy at best. The one thing the two models have in common is that both the DWS and the ExtremeContacts are very well priced for a UHPAS tire.

ARE L 303

would these be the turanza that everyone is refering to as bridgestone serenity?

Chas2

That would be them, and a different tire than the notorious Turanza EL-400

"Bridgestone Turanza with Serenity Technology tires are Bridgestone's Grand Touring All-Season tires developed for the drivers of sporty coupes and luxury performance sedans. Turanza with Serenity Technology tires are designed to provide Bridgestone's ultimate in ride and noise comfort while blending long wear with dry, wet and year-round traction, even in light snow.

Turanza with Serenity Technology tires mold a silica-reinforced, Long Link Carbon Black tread compound into an asymmetric design featuring continuous center and shoulder ribs that help reduce noise while providing constant road contact to enhance straight-line stability. Three circumferential and multiple lateral grooves help evacuate water to resist hydroplaning. The tire's internal structure includes twin, high-tensile steel belts reinforced by spirally wrapped nylon to stabilize the tread area and enhance handling, high-speed capability and ride quality while minimizing weight. A polyester cord body and rubber sidewall reinforcements enhance ride quality, steering response and cornering stability."

yue3759

I can chime on this topic. I had the DWS tires put on about a month ago and similar to what White05rl said, since then I've had the tires rebalanced twice due to steering wheel/car vibrating at high speeds.

I'm actually thinking of exchanging these with either the BS Serenity or Michelin Pilot Sport A/S Plus.

Would I recommend them? Not right now. But I'm sure they are others that love these tires. They do ride quiet though.

TampaRLX-SH

Thanks for the input guys. A friend just put the Conti DWS on his 07 TL. He is also reporting tramlining on grooved roads and some vibration issues. He has had them balanced and re-mounted twice. I thought it might just be an issue with the TLs lower profile size.

I have ordered the BS Serenity tires and will have them mounted next week.

Appreciate your time making the replies.

yue3759

Good call on the BS Serenity. I just called up my tire store and will be exchanging my DWS with the Serenity.

TampaRLX-SH

I am having the Serenties installed today. I am looking for the improvement over the tired MXM4s. I will report back my initial impressions.

TampaRLX-SH

I drove 84 miles today on the new Serenity tires. I have to say I am very pleased. Although I have been a Michelin fan, these tires are very quiet, very smooth and appear to have better rim protection than the MXM4s.

Of course any tire new, should be impressive. But from what I have read, these tires have staying power. I also notice that riding over lane reflectors and crosswalk lines there is less 'thump' than the Michelins. It may be the heavier tire, or again, just the newness. I can say it has restored a factory new feel to the RL.

We will see how they settle in, and even though it was rainy today, I did not press them being newly mounted. I expect they will handle significantly better than the ever increasingly slippery MXM4s. I managed a power slide turning onto an expressway when heading to my dealer this morning. As the RL slid sideways through the turn, all four wheels spinning, just as the tail started to slide out the VSA kicked in and tucked the tail in. The SHAWD on the display lit up on all four corners. Kinda fun, but not what I want in daily driving. I expect the Serenity tires will perform nicely.

yue3759

Good to hear you are enjoying the Serenitys so far. I'm swapping out my DWSs tomorrow with the Serenitys so I'll also report my initial impressions.

TampaRLX-SH

Did you swap the tires? Curious to your thoughts.

I am very pleased with the Serenity tires....they have returned a new car ride and feel to the RL. I have lowered the stereo volume by half, partly to listen how much quieter they are.

alfadoctor

I was seriously considering the Conti's as a replacement tire from what I have been reading and pricing was a good selling point also. After reading what you have posted here, I am going to pass on the Conti's and spend more money for another tire. I wasn't to keen on the Bridgestones as they have a lower tire wear index compared to others in this class of tire. Any thoughts? Bridgestones seem to me to have a very soft sidewall, unless they have changed.

Chas2

Search on the forum for Toyo Versados. While Toyo may not be considered a top tier tire as BS is, other have reported they really like them. They are a similar class of Grand Touring All Season tire, though not sold at the Tire Rack, which seems to be the best most convenient web site to use.

Toyo Versados are available in the stock size 245/50-17, and are V-Rated

poppintec

I actually just purchased the conti's I'll let you know my thoughts on them I have heard the opposite that these are a good tire, I hope those were just isolated cases....I'll let you guys know how they ride when I get them....I also had the versados they are a great tire in my opinon

yue3759

Sorry, work got a little crazy so haven't had the time to check the forum.

I did swap the tires my steering wheel vibration is gone. So far I really enjoy the BS Serenity, however, I feel that the Conti DWS ride just slightly quieter, especially when going over bumps.

yue3759

I'm curious to see how you like the Conti's. I bought them based on the review I read, but at the end the steering wheel vibration was too bad to deal with.

QUOTE=poppintec;12169712]I actually just purchased the conti's I'll let you know my thoughts on them I have heard the opposite that these are a good tire, I hope those were just isolated cases....I'll let you guys know how they ride when I get them....I also had the versados they are a great tire in my opinon[/QUOTE]

poppintec

we shall see lol....I read like 200 reviews I was stuck between those and eagle F1 but I heard the F1 is a very hard noisy tire, and for the type of driving I plan on doing I don't need Ultra high performance.....i got 245/35/19 all around hopefully be on by thursday or friday and ill let you guys know my thoughts

jmlaser

OK well here is my .02C
I depaxed my 06 for a set of enkei ekm3 wrapped with Continental DWS... I am disappointed with the tires. They stop very well and have great wet traction but feel very loose at highway speeds. I have tried 3 different tire pressures with no resolve. The car feels very soft and wiggly at highway speeds. It requires constant adjustment to keep it straight. Almost like it has a mind of its own.... not sure what to try, I bought the DWS due to its performance in the wet and snow but cant deal with the tramlining steering on the highway. Perhaps this is due to the soft sidewall when I am used to the very ridgid PAX tire....thoughts?

Ken1997TL

Thanks for the review, I was looking at the DWS for my '02 RL but I think i'll go with the Serenitys.

white05rl

I agree with JMLASER the DWS don't feel as stable at highway speeds and seem to need constant steering corrections.

TampaRLX-SH

I have been driving on the BS Turanza Serenity tires for over 2 weeks now.

I can say I am very pleased and they met my expectations so far. Compared to the MXM4s they are certainly quieter and smoother. They feel like a high performance tire in comparison, sticky and excellent wet traction. I have been comparing turns, rutty roads and concrete roads I drive daily, to the for MXM4s.

The BSs so have nylon belts, so you can feel them as they warm up. I would not call it flat spotting, but as the tires warm up, you feel them working. I do not feel the sidewalls are any firmer or softer than the MXM4s but the car has a more planted and sticky feel on the road. I note the impact noise to lane reflector, manholes and ruts is less of a 'thunk' than the MXM4s. On really rutted roads, I have noticed the few rattles from my interior (I think it was the glove-box door) have disappeared, there seems to be less harshness resonating to the cabin.

Steering is very true (I did have a 4 wheel alignment done with the install) and these tires, though more smooth and quiet, feel more planted in the steering feel. I connot yet compare mileage as I have had varied driving habits the past two weeks. If I get a long highway cruise on them I will be able to note any variance. A few trips across the bay bridges on cruise did not appear any difference in my RLs typical efficency.

As I have said before, much of this is expected with any new tire compared to a worn tire. But a friend with an 07 TL got the DWS and is disappointed with tram-lining, highway wandering and some vibration that has not be cured with 2 re-balanced and re-mounting the tires. I also contacted a few RL owners who went with the Serenity and have 10K+ miles and were advised they had no degradation in characteristics. Further a family member put the Serenity tires on his Toyota and now has 27K on them - reporting the same. And surprisingly they show virtually no wear. The Serenity tires are rated for 50K and I would expect to get better than the MXM4s which I retired at 34K. BS also has a great warranty.

The DWS were attractive for the cost and reported ratings, but I could not find them available in the RL size. And since Tire Rack offered a BS rebate when I purchased mine, they only cost a net $15 more than I would have paid for the DWS (if not on eternal back-order).

I am happy with my decision and am enjoying a new car ride and feel I did not know I was missing in my RL.

Chas2

Good data!

sirfergy

I wonder why the reviews make no mention of the tramlining. Is it something specific about the RL?

jmlaser

^ yeah thats what I was thinking,... Or something to do with AWD. Read another review somewhere online that had the same types of results with the squirmy ride and tramlining but the guy had an X-Drive (AWD) BMW

TampaRLX-SH

My friend who is reporting tramlining with the Conti DWS is driving an 07 TL, which is FWD.

jmlaser

well perhaps it is the tires then,....
I have it and my RL is AWD

poppintec

have had the conti's on for about a week and a half doing a lot of driving and I must say they are quiet ride very nice and have none of the problems discussed in the thread.....steering is straight with minimal corrections, but mine are 19's I dunno if that could make a difference

Chas2

It actually could make a difference...

The 245/50-17s are manufactured in France and Brazil

Assuming your 19's are 245/40-19, those are manufactured in Germany and Czech Republic...sooo there are likely different factories involved...with potential differing quality issues...

b0n3

One of my Michelin OEMs is on it's third plug .. slow leak .. can't stand these tires, so I'm going to order the Serenity tires today.

::logs onto TireRack::

Order complete .. will report ride quality soon

b0n3

I ended up getting the Toyo Versados .. seem like great tires

TampaRLX-SH

I read good things for the Toyos also. They have more limited distribution and subsequently fewer ratings forums for comparisons. I also have had no personal experience with them.

Like the Conti's, I had no one local with them in stock and (RL's odd size) so I ultimately decided upon the BS Serenity, which I am very pleased. Along with the quiet and smooth attributes, they feel much sportier than the OEM Michelins...which I did not expect. If they wear as good as or better than the Michelins (as they are rated) and certainly surpass a summer tire in wear, I will be a convert. I have been a Michelin buyer for some time, and would have gone with the Pilot Sports, but the price differential, consumer ratings, better wear ratings and better warranty made it worth the try.

Do share you observations as it appears this topic is getting much traffic of late.

poppintec

Versados are a good tire and I have to say I have had the conti's on for a while and they ride good and are very quiet...not to mention the 50k tread rating they should last for quite some time

b0n3

I was trying to get the Conti's, my dealer could only find two in the whole country because of the backorder .. but because of a slow leaking OEM Michelin, I needed something soon. So I ordered the Serenities from Tirerack, then backed out at the last minute after reading some negative reviews for winter driving.

I got the Toyos at Town Fair Tire (they price matched Treadepot). My initial impression was "wow, these are quiet!". Unfortunately, my vibration issue still exists at highway speeds. Many attempts at balancing, alignment, road force have failed. Replacing a bent rim didn't help. I figured a new set of tires would take me into the "smooth as glass" ride I've been dreaming of since I bought the car. Nada, still bouncing like the Harlem Globetrotters are in the trunk. I have an appoinment with Acura to get this resolved once and for all.

In any case, cornering with the Toyos is effortless, sticks to the road nicely. We had a bad rain storm here yesterday and I was a bit nervous but the Toyos held tight with no hydroplaning on the highway. Very impressed so far. Sooo much nicer than the stock .. I'm still wondering if my gas mileage will go up or down. So far I avg. about 17 mpg at an avg speed of 30 mph. Crappy.

I have 30 days to test run these .. I'll report back with anything new .. but so far a big thumbs up

TampaRLX-SH

I am at a month now with the Serenties. No changes in behavior since mounted.

I find them surprisingly sporty. They feel very sticky yet offer the quiet / smooth factor I was hoping for over the OEM Michelins. I have had opportunity to drive in some summer torrential downpours and they were effortless. No slip, no squeal, no hydroplaning.

Highway mileage seems unaffected, but in my city driving it has dropped 1mpg average (my last two tanks were nearly identical - AVG MPH was 22 and AVG MPG was 17.5) That is my 'worst case' driving. I have yet to drive a full tank on a highway cruise, but the few trips I took on the highway still produced 28+ mpg (even topping 31.5 mpg on a one hour cruise).

I believe the Contis were the lightest tire, the BS are heavier and do feel more substantial and planted over the OEMs. I am expecting long wear and durability from these tires. The warranty is higher rated and I believe the wear is rated for 50K. I'll be happy to get 35K out of any tire in my mixed driving.

No change in the tire 'warm up'. I would be stretching to call it flat spotting (which my TL was a victim of). But the 1st mile or two in the morning at 45mph I can feel the belts working, especially if the car sits a day.

No issues with vibrations, howling at speed and they even seem quieter in the rain. I am running them at 35 psi all around. I have yet to experiment with psi to see if it affects the behavior as I am very happy with them as is.

Also, I got my $60 rebate AMEX card from Tire Rack yesterday. Drinks on me!

danmm7

iTrader: (1)

I have the Conti DWS tires on my 06 RL for close to 15k miles now. Size 245-45-18 mounted on brand new wheels from tirerack.com Tires are made in Portugal.

I am generally very happy with these tires. Low road noise, great traction, nice looks, very low wear. When i put them on the car i did get 4-wheel alignment. Car was driving straight and smooth for the first 15k miles. No vibration at all. I did not notice any disturbing pulling to the side.

The last two weeks....IN THE MORNING, when the tires are still cool, for the first 5-6 miles or so, i am feeling vibration in the steering wheel @ 60mph+. Not sure if this requires a simple re-balance of the tires (15k miles on them with very little wear) ....if it's flat spotting ...or something else is wrong with my car.

Also, i do notice now that sometimes my car pulls more to one side. I keep blaming it on the road but it may have something to do with the tires. Or maybe i need alignment again, only 15k miles later?!?!?

I used to keep the tires at 36-37psi. Lately, i have not added any air and they are at 31-32psi when cold. I will bump them to 37psi again and i will see if this helps.

Chas2

IMHO, 15K miles is not out of line for a realignment. Vibration is not an alignment issue, however the pulling could be.

It could be both a balance and alignment issue. See what your mechanic says.

white05rl

danmm7 I AM WITH YOU! I was so anxious to get my DWS it drove me crazy. They finally arrived thru NTB and i had the works done (mounted balanced, alignment, etc.). These are on standard RL wheels, too. So after leaving the installar i noticed smooth right, really quiet and a little drift to the right. drove it for one day and took it back. the tires' balance was checked and turned out to be way off. Also, i need an alignment which i approved. All done and i'm on my way home.

two days later my freinds are laughing at me because now changes lanes in two seconds if you let go of the wheel. the steering wheel also shakes at 75-80MPH...again. another case of being out of balance.

finally took to dealership (ntb gave me my $100 back) and it seems really, really close. I still say the tires stink. Today alone i drove from Destin, FL to McKinney, TX - 800mi. Lot's of nuisance vibration and constantly holding the steering wheel at 9 o'clock to push own. otherwise there would be a lane change.

My mechanics all suck, so i feel that i'm on my own with this. Tomorrow I'll switch the two from tires/swap them and see what happens.

I don't suppose you'll be in texas anytime soon so we can swap wheels/tires and try that?! I'm game!